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80's Cartoons Anonymous 09/05/2020 (Sat) 03:43:30 No. 4807
What are you anons currently watching? I've been re-watching The Transformers, TMNT and The Real Ghostbusters.
>>4807 I don't watch or like 80s cartoons. I have a little to say about Transformers. I don't get the hype. Yeah yeah cool toys but people are so autistic about this franchise & the absolute production mess that is G1 that I expected to get something out of it. I tried watching some episodes when that alcoholic cunt Craig was streaming it. The bad animation, dumb plots, & a billion "characters" kept me away for most of it. The movie itself is cool but it has all the problems the series has.
>>4810 For me is just dumb fun. I grew up with Transformers and watch the movie every Christmas. I never try to take it too seriously and just enjoy watching the good robot aliens kicking the bad robot aliens's ass.
>>4814 There's just nothing for me to grab onto. No interesting plots, characters come outta nowhere, & didn't have anything to really say other than "freedom good". Which is a good message in of itself but not enough to carry a toy commercial for me. Stuff like Bionicle, Gundam, Kamen Rider, & Ultraman show you can easily do a lot of great things with shows primarily marketing toys. I will admit I also have a bias against cars. They just aren't cool to me. Bikes, jets, & any sort of animal though make great transformation options to me.
>>4816 Maybe try the new Transformers: War of Cybertron Siege show. I think that is more straight forward (Is on Shitflix though so better pirate it). And if you like videogames give Transformers Devastation and Fall of Cybertron a try. Some say Beast Wars is pretty good but i have never watched it. There is also a discussion on /v/ about the lore which is pretty weird >>>/v/74747.
>>4818 No I tried that Netflix show. It's terrible. Like I not even G1 nostalgia hungry fans would like it. I did play Fall of Cybertron years ago. Two good games there. Wish I held onto them. Beast Wars is one of those shows that aged like fruit. Meaning is very very quickly rotted. Writing quality I have no idea but the CGI is absolutely awful. Even worse in Beast Machines where they get more detailed uncanny faces.
>>4810 The Transformers G1 cartoon is for a very young audience and is riddled with animation errors. The movie at least has better animation and a good soundtrack, though. But your complaints about the story and characters are all pretty much fixed in the G1 comics. I highly recommend those. The original comics published by Marvel in the '80s. Not any of the other ones that might call themselves "Generation 1," which are all different things. The original comics had much more fleshed out characters and complex and interesting plots. >>4819 >shitting on Beast Wars naw. Season 1 is a bit iffy with some of the animations, but Mainframe was mostly good at knowing their limitations and working around them. Season 1 also isn't as strong with its plots, but 2 and 3 get much better, and Season 3 has much better animation. The stories and characters in Beast Wars are also both excellent. A high point for the franchise. Nothing else later has come close.
>>4836 Back when Marvel could actually write good stories, I'd imagine. I hear that Japan has an even sillier japanese dub for not just G1 but the whole franchise then an exclusive continuity season plus a manga. No idea how their quality is. >>4836 It's the animation that doesn't hold up even if the writing does.
>>4837 I'd say the animation in Beast Wars (and other Mainframe shows, like ReBoot) holds up a lot better than almost any other CG, not just from its era, but from a long time after. It does get significantly better in Season 3, though. Mainframe typically made much better designs and worked within their limitations much better than even modern CGI. It's a hell of a lot better than the Japanese Transformers CGI shows that came out years later. I might even go so far as to say it is more appealing than Prime. I know I'll catch flak for that. But then 1v1 me, motherfuckers. >Back when Marvel could actually write good stories, I'd imagine. Their downfall was very recent and very sudden, and the '80s was arguably their peak. The '80s Transformers comics are what almost everything later is based on, moreso than the cartoon. Though the movie is sorta canon to both the cartoon and the comics. >Japanese Transformers Oh boy. Well that's a whole rabbit hole, with much more material than American Transformers. I tried to explain it to someone on /v/ a while back, and the post is still up, so I'll copy it here... In America, there was always at least two continuities, the comics and the tv show. And also there were smaller continuities, like the bios on the back of toy packages, as well as "micro-continuities," like one-off storybooks or whatever. The continuities were mostly pretty similar, though, enough that Beast Wars just sort of considered it all canon and it wasn't really a problem. Also, there was the UK, where they published extra comics that were considered canon there in addition to the US comics, which were also published there, but with slight edits to make the UK exclusive stuff fit into it. After Beast Machines, the whole franchise got a hard reboot with Robots in Disguise, originally made in Japan and called Car Robots, which is a new continuity, as far as the west is concerned. Then after that there were a series of three more animes that were originally not in continuity with each other, but the english localization mashed them together and said they were the "Unicron Trilogy." There were convention exclusive comics and text stories and even live script readings that were all canon and tied together. They began in the Beast Wars era and continued a little after Beast Machines and took the story a little bit further, but it got cancelled in the middle of a big story where a bunch of the best warriors from throughout the multiverse were fighting Unicron, because oh yeah, Unicron is actually only one guy in every continuity, and he goes from universe to universe wrecking shit. Same with Primus, I think. I'm not clear on this, but I assume each body in different universes is its own thing but he inhabits all bodies at once, because obviously we see Unicron (his body at the very least) get destroyed in multiple continuities). Also, I don't think they ever explained how the fuck Unicron could be the same guy in every continuity when the G1 cartoon, the most prominent continuity of all, gives him a wildly different origin than everything else, and his origin in all the other versions is really important to the entire idea that he's one multiverse-hopping guy in the first place. Anyway, more convention exclusive stories that now focused on the Unicron Trilogy characters had them join the fight against Unicron that began in the post-Beast Machines-focused convention exclusive comics, and the characters from the G1/Beast Wars/Machines continuity sort of just fizzled out as basically their final story got stolen by guys from a different continuity, and that's the end of the original Transformers continuity. It just fizzled out. Or you can ignore all the convention exclusive stuff and just count the end of Beast Machines as the end, but actually the convention exclusive comics are really cool, so it just sucks they never got a good ending. In Japan, they went in the other direction. Fuck multiple continuities, everything is canon in the same universe. At least everything that was actually published in Japan. So all those comics don't count. But the G1 cartoon does, except for the last couple episodes, because they never aired in Japan, and instead Japan made their own sequel series that disregarded those episodes, and then made a bunch more sequel series, as well as manga, and sometimes important shit that explained how all these series could possibly be connected was actually only explained in like one-page promotional manga published in the Japanese equivalent of TV Guide, or things like that.
So Beast Wars happened and it was a bit comedic, but Japan basically did a gag dub of it. Also, they made Airazor male instead of female, so when she started a romance with Tigatron, they basically just made them gay, for laughs. Also the eventual dub of Beast Machines, which was years delayed, basically made Silverbolt and Nightscream gay (again as a joke), and Blackarachnia made fun of them and called them "gayboys." Anyway, between seasons of Beast Wars, Japan just needed more, so they made their own Beast Wars anime. Two of them, in fact. But they aren't about the same characters, or even take place at the same time. They take place in the far future or something (even compared to Beast Wars). And the two of them are about two different sets of characters, none of whom are at all related to the regular Beast Wars series. But they do transform into animals. Airing Beast Machines was delayed in japan, they didn't bother airing it at first. Instead they did a series called Car Robots, which was dubbed as Robots in Disguise in English, and was used a reboot. But not in Japan. In Japan, Car Robots takes place in the original continuity. The Optimus and Megatron in that series are not the original Optimus and Megatron, nor are they the ones from Beast Wars. Also there was another guy called Galvatron in one of the Beast Wars anime, and he's not this Megatron either, or the original, or the one from Beast Wars. They're new guys who just have similar names. Anyway I guess Car Robots takes place in the present? Which would place it before Season 3 of the original cartoon? I'm not clear on this. Anyway, I don't know why I wrote all this because in the end, I still can't comprehend how they tried to say that the Unicron Trilogy was all supposed to be in the same continuity as everything that came before, when they weren't even made to take place in the same continuity as each other, but that's where Kiss Players comes in. Not only does Kiss Players put the Unicron Trilogy together, it tries to make sense of the entire fucking mess that came before, and connect the Unicron Trilogy series to that, too. Later, they even published an official timeline that tried to say even everything that came out later, including the live action movies, was somehow the same continuity as G1. I think everyone just fucking disregards that though because that's just plain bullshit and they never did some sort of Kiss Players story to try to mash it into making sense. Meanwhile, in the west, they accidentally got themselves into the same conundrum of trying to say everything was the same continuity when they tried to say there was only one Unicron across all continuities. But this got fucked up when they did that one game that mixed the War for Cybertron continuity (which they tried to make the "main" continuity, saying it was the same as Prime, Rescue Bots, the second Robots in Disguise cartoon, and a bunch of comics and novels) with the Bayformers universe. That fucked everything up so much that they had to do a whole comics event where they did some DC Comics style shit that rewrote the entire fabric of the universe so they could say that Unicron was actually a different guy in each universe again. But it's not like it made things any better, since by this point the comics had gone full SJW and tried to argue that somehow a race of asexual robots could be trannies, and on the other hand you had Bayformers. The cartoons are still okay, I guess, but I just can't bring myself to give a shit about them. Oh yeah, also I should mention how despite Beast Wars kind of combining all G1 continuities and just saying they all go together, there are also a bunch of comics that go with the G1 Marvel US comics but say they don't go with each other. So there were also Marvel G2 comics, which are pretty much a straight continuation of Marvel G1, but Marvel UK comics, which were basically filler (but good filler) to the Marvel US comics, aren't canon, even though they were written by the same guy who wrote the end of US G1 and all of G2. Then many years later there were things like Regeneration One, which is another sequel to Marvel G1, written by the same guy who did G2, but now he says G2 isn't canon to this. In the middle, there's a text story called Alignment which is again written by this same guy, and functions as a link between G2 and Beast Wars, but in the process mentions elements from UK and even Japanese stuff, clearly for fanservice more than anything, but it just shows how stupid it is to say things like this aren't canon. Alignment was a convention exclusive story, but it wasn't at the official Transformers convention, so unlike a bunch of other convention exclusive stories, it's not technically canon, even though it's by far the most important one and is basically the closest you'll get to an ending to G1, in addition to showing how it connects to Beast Wars. None of this is even getting into how the Movie is sort of canon to both the cartoon and the comics, but they say it isn't, even though it's quite heavily referenced, especially in the UK comics, but the UK comics have tons of different alternate future timelines that characters keep going back in time and erasing and replacing with new timelines, resulting in two different Galvatrons (who is future Megatron) running around at the same time as two different Megatrons. Keep in mind though, these UK comics are by far the best piece of Transformers media that exist, so don't think I'm saying they're bad. Just that they're complicated as fuck. I just realized a guy in this thread already linked to the /v/ thread I copied this from, but fuck it.
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>>4807 >What are you anons currently watching? jap shit but every once in a while I go back to watch Exo-Squad
>>4858 >>4859 Man I gotta be honest. This is all retardedly complicated.
>>4896 That's what makes it so good. Personally, I don't give much of a shit about anything that isn't in the original continuity. Or rather, "continuity family," which is what they call it when a bunch of technically distinct continuities are basically considered the same thing. Like how in the '80s there was the G1 cartoon, the G1 comics, the toys (with bios), storybooks and stuff like that, and they're all technically separate continuities, but fuck it. Close enough. And Beast Wars and Beast Machines also count in that family. But on the other hand, I also like to take a broad view approach to continuity. I like to consider as much canon as possible. Like technically the Marvel UK comics are not considered canon to the Marvel G2 comics, but that's bullshit. Yeah, there are slight differences, like the story where they meet GI Joe is different because GI Joe had a different comic in the UK, but there are also bits from the UK comic that are referenced in the US comic, including the G2 comic. Fuck it. You might as well squint and count it as canon. But if you read the G1 comics, both US and UK, and watch the G1 cartoon, and Beast Wars and Beast Machines, then the next step is to watch the anime up to Car Robots. They're all still pretty much G1 continuity, and they don't wreck the continuity too hard, if you squint. And they get light references in the convention exclusive comics, implying that they're canon there, albeit they would require slight differences to make them fit perfectly. The convention exclusive comics are the last piece of the puzzle in the G1 continuity family. Everything after Car Robots and Beast Machines (or rather the convention exclusive stories based on Beast Machines) are a different continuity (family) and can be disregarded. Except later a hentai manga named Kiss Players did some time travel stuff to make the next three anime series technically considered the same continuity, at least in Japan. And then later American comics would establish stronger rules for the makeup of the multiverse, tying things together in that way, but you don't need to worry about it. Oh yeah, also there's an official Facebook Page that acts as if it's run by Alpha Trion or one of the other godlike near-omniscient Transformers, and what it says (in character) is considered canon. So that's a clusterfuck and I just pretty much ignore it since it's literally the equivalent of counting the Sonic the Hedgehog twitter as canon, and as funny as that would be, you can't rely on it for consistent canon, especially since it isn't even in any particular continuity.
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>>4807 Mysterious Cities of Gold (1982), though I'm currently a few episodes into season 3 (2016) season 2 (2012, yes 30 years after the original it got season 2) was pretty good, if a bit more laidback and childish than the original; they aren't exploring dying empires anymore (S2 is China, which was fairly prosperous in the early 1500s) and there's no one overtly threatening their safety for the most part like Pizarro or the Olmecs did (aside from minor arc villains the only major villain actually wants the heroes to find the cities), but it's still ADVENTURE as fuck the children are more fearless as a result of their experiences, and Mendoza kind of went through the bulk of his character growth in season 1, but this kind of removes personal conflict as a story element, so the writers had to create some less organic drama; Mendoza disappears from the story sometimes so he can do shit that makes it look like he's supporting the villain, Tao decides he's sick of Esteban's chosen one-ness (he's mostly butthurt about Esteban's secret origins), and Esteban's father is alive and trying to make anti-cancer meds but gets kidnapped at the end of the season season 3 has them in Japan (ostensibly much more dangerous than China at the time) and they run into an old friend (Gaspard from season 1, who's training soldiers in the use of rifles). Local lords are trying to wage a war around them and want their cool flying machine >>4864 any idea where I can find good quality rips of Exo-Squad? I only ever seem to find trash quality
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>>4898 >season 3 has them in Japan (ostensibly much more dangerous than China at the time) and they run into an old friend (Gaspard from season 1, who's training soldiers in the use of rifles). Local lords are trying to wage a war around them and want their cool flying machine Do they meet William Adams and help him battle youkai?
>>4899 unlikely; MCoG takes place starting in 1532, William Adams was born in 1564
>>4810 G1 was good in bursts, sometimes it came off as good but yeah as mentioned its mostly just a childrens show. Some episodes were fun and gave interesting ideas; and probably were the final turning point in regards to whether transformers should just try proper stories rather than a giant mess of whatever. But it really is just incredibly inconsistent, you'd think Fire in the Sky saying Starscream was a scientist would be ignored or kept; but the show seriously just keeps on swapping back and forth. Season 1/3 are probably the higher points; both have a higher consistency to whether they're really trying at all. Too bad that doesn't apply to season 3s animation; which is usually the worst the show has to offer. All and all, i think ideas and backgrounds are the best the show has; not exactly worth it to watch much of it. The movie is a pretty fun romp even if it is almost incoherent due to how much of it was just cut out. >>4858 >After Beast Machines, the whole franchise got a hard reboot with Robots in Disguise, originally made in Japan and called Car Robots, which is a new continuity, as far as the west is concerned. It should be pointed out, Car Robots was officially a part of G1 and western dub wise its wasn't super distinct. >Then after that there were a series of three more animes that were originally not in continuity with each other, but the english localization mashed them together and said they were the "Unicron Trilogy." Fun fact about this, the unicron trilogy was pre-planned and armada-energon were a part of the same series even in japan. It seems like the japs really didn't want to follow the outline that was made in the west and constantly ignored it till the point of galaxy force where they just made it detached; except even in japan this was retconned into it being the sequel to energon. The english version of armada actually uses earlier versions of episodes, and energon has a dub thats practically nonsense and the only episode they cut is a major character one. Like seriously, the armada toyline had shit that a leaked version of the clear "energon linking point" actually integrated into the show but it is nonexistent in the final. They wanted to use classic characters around the time of unicron arriving, so you have shit like Terrorsaur in the toyline.
>>10404 Actually i misremembered, it was the outline for energon; not the end of armada. I could post all of it but instead i'll just post what i remember rather than digging it up. They find "classic" transformers in unicrons insides(one thing this actually shows is that armada wasn't actually meant to have a fight against unicron); they get mutated by staying in unicron gaining combination abilities(something the autobots in energon retained). And minicons becoming "Omnicons" which also did make it into energon but i don't even remember what the final show really gives as an explanation in regards to them. Basically the outline calls this process unicron turning them into drones, megatron thinks if he finds unicrons spark he can control him so he touches it and begins to mutate rapidly and becomes "galvatron"; the whole "megatron tries to control unicron and it backfires" exists in the final show. Primus was also a part of the outline so it seems that while the final shows are pretty fucking detached they did loosely follow them; though the bios make me think they sometimes very intentionally went in the other direction like with starscream just getting mind wiped. A lot of the bios seem to be reliant on something that isn't the show; starscreams reflects what you would think he'd do in the show so i have to think his armada character arc was actually something planned from the start. The english bios make it pretty clear that the random extreme design changes for some of the armada characters wasn't intended; in fact Demolishor got a third repaint for the cybertron line. Galaxy Force/Cybertron notably feature a really weird continuity in the bios, there's this pretty fleshed out minicon conflict so i have to imagine it was an outline thing; Thunderblast is randomly noted to be friends with Sideways so i have to think the starscream allegiance was planned from the start though was probably intended to last. The black hole focus in the bios makes it seem like it was always intended for unicron to become one after he "died", even if the insanely stupid way they attached it to energon is now reliant on it. Though unicron got a totally new design and toy so who knows.


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